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I've decided to do it.

A few weeks back, I saw the new Star Trek movie and left it with some serious questions about what it meant for the Trek universe I have been a fan of since I was a kid. It seemed to me that the basic premise of the new movie was a "cheat" that by the rules established in the Trek world, it had no basis for. After further discussion with other fans on my flist, I decided the only way to resolve the problem was to just go back and study show and movie canon on multiverses and time-travel.

I came up with a list of episodes and films that deal with these topics.

I wasn't sure if the study and analysis was really worth the time, though. Especially given arguments friends made about how new movie is not making the questionable move I think it is. The only way to be sure there was a problem worth geeking over addressing was to go see the movie again, which I did today.

Why do I, and most other fans believe the new movie is trying to create a new alternate universe by showing someone going back in time and changing history? Because, as it turns out, that's exactly what the movie is claiming to do. Young!Spock hypothesizes about this about mid-way through the movie, and the characters of course realize the logic in it and continue to make reference to it. That doesn't make it true, however, and the alternative hypothesis that this an alternate universe that already existed prior to Nero's arrival is still possible. I looked for evidence for that theory as I watched the second time through, because I prefer that theory (there's plenty of canon supporting pre-existing multiverses with almost identical histories to our Trekverse), and it would be pretty damned funny if Nero went back in time to destroy the Federation and ended up in a universe other than his own at the same time.

But like I said, that's not what the movie *thinks* it is doing. So now I need to know if there is canon to support time-travel creating alternate universes in the Trekverse, or if the creation of this alternate time-line wiped out my beloved Trek verse history for a new version.

I am not going to post on every episode and movie I have on the list, just watch them as I have time and take notes and post whenever I'm done and have a conclusion. Because it's summer and I'm bored and have nothing better to do. You know, except for work...and dating, and spending time with my friends and redecorating my house and working on three different fiction projects.

ETA: And just for the record, my goal is to find a reason to embrace the new Trek whole-heartedly. Because JJA has tried very hard to give the Trekkies what they want, and what we want is Moar Trek.

Comments

( 13 comments — Leave a comment )
cornerofmadness
Jun. 8th, 2009 02:56 am (UTC)
Yep trouble and tribblations from DS9 where there are time police who bemoan Kirk constantly changing the timeline. (Or at least that's how I remember it.it's been years)

the more important question to me is why didn't spock just change it again to make sure mom/vulcan doesn't die. that's what made no real sense to me as much as I otherwise liked it.
butterfly
Jun. 8th, 2009 03:17 am (UTC)
Didn't Kirk and Spock use up all the red matter in defeating Nero? This time might not have the tech required to get/make more. Plus, it didn't look like the time travel aspect was very controllable. He'd probably end up going back another hundred+ years and be dead before he had a chance to save his mom/planet.
cornerofmadness
Jun. 8th, 2009 03:28 am (UTC)
that could be. Though Kirk and SPock have time traveled so many times they should be able to have figured it out. Oh well I've come to accept the AU
masqthephlsphr
Jun. 8th, 2009 03:54 am (UTC)
Yes, I remember you saying that in your LJ. And do you know the reason why you expected that to happen up until the end? Because that's what happened in every TV episode and movie up until now. Because otherwise history *in their own universe* would go differently, unless they went back in time and fixed it. No new universe was created with the new history while the old one went merrily on as it always did.

Which is why now suddenly going back in time just creates a parallel universe while the old one goes merrily on doesn't make any sense.
cornerofmadness
Jun. 8th, 2009 04:02 am (UTC)
yes but that is a very popular quantum physics theory that our physicist tried to explain to me but it went over my head. I had no trouble accepting i t
masqthephlsphr
Jun. 8th, 2009 04:09 am (UTC)
What quantum physics says isn't as important as the internal rules the fictional universe creates for itself and insists it must follow in every episode. To suddenly decide to break one of those rules for a plot device...well, I just need to satisfy myself they are breaking their own rules. Or not.
cornerofmadness
Jun. 8th, 2009 04:12 am (UTC)
I don't think they are. Wish I could find that DS9 eppy I was talking about since I'm pretty sure the cops were complaining about Kirk and him altering timelines willy nilly
masqthephlsphr
Jun. 8th, 2009 04:14 am (UTC)
That episode is on my list.
cornerofmadness
Jun. 8th, 2009 04:31 am (UTC)
let's see, star trek IV the voyage home was ALL about time travel, and they effectly totally change the course of life for whales

Star Trek movies Generations and First Contact also involve time travel

Yesterday's Enterprise (TNG) where we have an alt timeline Yar

City on the Edge of Forever (TOS)

Parallels (TNG) which i think DOES say that for each action a new universe is created going off that quantum theory i mentioned


Mirror Mirror (TOS) is definitely alt universe but not necessarily based off a time line choice.

The voyage home (TOS)

They have used many different methods of time travel but they seem to favor replacing the timeline over creating all new universes
masqthephlsphr
Jun. 8th, 2009 04:47 am (UTC)
All already on my list.
cornerofmadness
Jun. 8th, 2009 05:01 am (UTC)
sounds like you're on your way then. googling around it looks like there are several articles out there on this topic. don't know what they're about (dial up doesn't make random clicking easy)
masqthephlsphr
Jun. 8th, 2009 05:02 am (UTC)
You know me, I got dig in and figure it out for myself. I've been going into Fandom Analysis withdrawal since I stopped working on my ATPo site.

; D
cornerofmadness
Jun. 8th, 2009 03:28 pm (UTC)
this does not surprise me at all. Good luck
( 13 comments — Leave a comment )